Beautiful, Jordan. Thank you. ❤️. My own sense of "getting to have your cake and eat it too" is that even though nothing ever resolves, nothing ever concretizes or crystallizes as some-thing, this emptiness always appears as something and we get to partake of that "something's" endless richness, reveling in all the apparent forms and flavors, even if none of them can ultimately be found. As you said, it's the most beautiful and astonishing paradox of nothing being here at the same time, everything being here. Truly mind-blowing, isn't it? :-)
I appreciate this view of “having the cake and eating it too.” I totally see what you mean by that! It’s so wonderful that we still get to enjoy all this apparently form-full flavorfulness even after noticing its unresolvability.
I guess in the moment of writing I was noticing that there do seem to be many sacrifices on this path -- mainly of fixed ideas, fixed beliefs, fixed identities -- which can feel like quite daunting or painful sacrifices at certain points, though on the ‘other side’ it usually feels like, “why was it a big deal to let that go?”
Interestingly I just found this quote in Peter’s book ‘Dirty Enlightenment’ that captures the painful sacrifices...
Questioner: I read a book that describes enlightenment as “disappointment”...
Peter: Yes. The process can be, anyway. Seeing reality brings the loss of everything we’ve ever held dear in the old way we’ve valued it. It’s seeing that all our most precious stories about ourselves are hollow. It’s seeing that the life we thought we were living is all worthless. And there’s not even anyone to care about that loss, or to enjoy that stuff if it WAS true. Because in reality there’s no one there, there’s no thing there, so it’s a total loss in terms of what was hoped for, what was expected. I’ve been painting it from the point of view that it’s ecstasy, but it’s also absolutely nothing, emptiness, absolute void. It’s truly the death of the individual, that which we’ve always feared, because it’s the loss of ALL separation, the loss of all individuality, the loss of self. BUT, it’s not really a loss either, because nothing is lost. Everything is just seen for what it is and has always been. There never WAS any substance to these pretty sentiments that we valued so much, they were NEVER real. And we’ve always kind of known that, which is why we struggle so much to validate them and glorify them. If they were real, we could just sit back and let them take care of themselves; but we’ve always kind of known that we were pretending, wishfully thinking “I really WANT this to be true”.
Wonderful! This was moving to read. Thank you for sharing it.
I find these insights come in stages, or waves. Usually there’s a particularly big wave somewhere in the mix. But there are inevitably more to follow. So long as we go on living, as we encounter new life experiences, more is illuminated, and there are ever subtler opportunities for being with things as they are.
It helps a hell of a lot to be with other people who are going through this/have gone through it. I see you’re connected to a network of writers who share information about this. Have you found opportunities to connect with other people in this context in person, as well?
Thank you! Wonderful to hear hahah... presently experience seems too slippery for eternalism : ) any fixed idea doesn't allow it to simply be and flow as it is
I was tempted to welcome you to the club, only there is no club and if it were, it wouldn't accept me as a member, which is fine. All the best to you anyway.
This is beautiful, Jordon. I can totally relate. The mind keeps trying to get a grip. And yet, when we relax into simply being this whole happening, the imaginary problem dissolves. In my experience, this happens again and again, not once and for all. I love your baby picture. Pure delight with no need for any explanation. And I love you. I feel we are all one whole happening exploring, discovering, unfolding, celebrating and enjoying itself. ❤️
Thank you so much for the beautiful words, Joan 😊❤️🔥 I love you too
I am curious what you make of the Tony Parsons and Jim Newmans who claim that the ‘me’ or sense of separation dropped away once and for all
I’ve read where you’ve said you spent a long time feeling like the ‘me’ needed to ‘drop’ or something like that… I find it fascinating that Peter never emphasized this at all
Presently it’s being seen quite clearly that no solid findable ‘me’ has ever been there… it does feel like the sense of a solid resolvable ‘me’ is the ‘root concretization’ underlying ~all other solidifications
In my experience, the thought-sense of "me" can still show up, for example, any time I feel threatened or defensive. But there's no secondary thought-story any more about how "I" need to get rid of the "me" in order to be a more spiritually advanced "me." It's just a mirage that comes and goes. And like the water in the mirage, when we look for it, it can't be found.
Beautiful, Jordan. Thank you. ❤️. My own sense of "getting to have your cake and eat it too" is that even though nothing ever resolves, nothing ever concretizes or crystallizes as some-thing, this emptiness always appears as something and we get to partake of that "something's" endless richness, reveling in all the apparent forms and flavors, even if none of them can ultimately be found. As you said, it's the most beautiful and astonishing paradox of nothing being here at the same time, everything being here. Truly mind-blowing, isn't it? :-)
Yes, it really is! Thank you, John.
I appreciate this view of “having the cake and eating it too.” I totally see what you mean by that! It’s so wonderful that we still get to enjoy all this apparently form-full flavorfulness even after noticing its unresolvability.
I guess in the moment of writing I was noticing that there do seem to be many sacrifices on this path -- mainly of fixed ideas, fixed beliefs, fixed identities -- which can feel like quite daunting or painful sacrifices at certain points, though on the ‘other side’ it usually feels like, “why was it a big deal to let that go?”
🙏🏼💙
Interestingly I just found this quote in Peter’s book ‘Dirty Enlightenment’ that captures the painful sacrifices...
Questioner: I read a book that describes enlightenment as “disappointment”...
Peter: Yes. The process can be, anyway. Seeing reality brings the loss of everything we’ve ever held dear in the old way we’ve valued it. It’s seeing that all our most precious stories about ourselves are hollow. It’s seeing that the life we thought we were living is all worthless. And there’s not even anyone to care about that loss, or to enjoy that stuff if it WAS true. Because in reality there’s no one there, there’s no thing there, so it’s a total loss in terms of what was hoped for, what was expected. I’ve been painting it from the point of view that it’s ecstasy, but it’s also absolutely nothing, emptiness, absolute void. It’s truly the death of the individual, that which we’ve always feared, because it’s the loss of ALL separation, the loss of all individuality, the loss of self. BUT, it’s not really a loss either, because nothing is lost. Everything is just seen for what it is and has always been. There never WAS any substance to these pretty sentiments that we valued so much, they were NEVER real. And we’ve always kind of known that, which is why we struggle so much to validate them and glorify them. If they were real, we could just sit back and let them take care of themselves; but we’ve always kind of known that we were pretending, wishfully thinking “I really WANT this to be true”.
Wonderful! This was moving to read. Thank you for sharing it.
I find these insights come in stages, or waves. Usually there’s a particularly big wave somewhere in the mix. But there are inevitably more to follow. So long as we go on living, as we encounter new life experiences, more is illuminated, and there are ever subtler opportunities for being with things as they are.
It helps a hell of a lot to be with other people who are going through this/have gone through it. I see you’re connected to a network of writers who share information about this. Have you found opportunities to connect with other people in this context in person, as well?
Ah, never mind! I looked closer at your work and see you create many opportunities for people to come together in person.
This is wonderful. Really appreciate the delineation of eternalism. I'm a reformed eternalist.
Thank you! Wonderful to hear hahah... presently experience seems too slippery for eternalism : ) any fixed idea doesn't allow it to simply be and flow as it is
Wow!
thank you <3
I was tempted to welcome you to the club, only there is no club and if it were, it wouldn't accept me as a member, which is fine. All the best to you anyway.
Hahah thanks for the non-welcome to the non-club. All the best to you too 🙏🏼
This is beautiful, Jordon. I can totally relate. The mind keeps trying to get a grip. And yet, when we relax into simply being this whole happening, the imaginary problem dissolves. In my experience, this happens again and again, not once and for all. I love your baby picture. Pure delight with no need for any explanation. And I love you. I feel we are all one whole happening exploring, discovering, unfolding, celebrating and enjoying itself. ❤️
Thank you so much for the beautiful words, Joan 😊❤️🔥 I love you too
I am curious what you make of the Tony Parsons and Jim Newmans who claim that the ‘me’ or sense of separation dropped away once and for all
I’ve read where you’ve said you spent a long time feeling like the ‘me’ needed to ‘drop’ or something like that… I find it fascinating that Peter never emphasized this at all
Presently it’s being seen quite clearly that no solid findable ‘me’ has ever been there… it does feel like the sense of a solid resolvable ‘me’ is the ‘root concretization’ underlying ~all other solidifications
In my experience, the thought-sense of "me" can still show up, for example, any time I feel threatened or defensive. But there's no secondary thought-story any more about how "I" need to get rid of the "me" in order to be a more spiritually advanced "me." It's just a mirage that comes and goes. And like the water in the mirage, when we look for it, it can't be found.
🙏🏼💙 thank you